Why Can't Women be Proud?
How thrilling it is to be proud of yourself, but why do so many women not admit it? I talked to my friend, author Elise Loehnen, who has written about this very thing. Ladies, we have work to do...
Why can’t women be proud? Hey, great question! So, I talked to my friend Elise Loehnen, the author of the new book, On Our Best Behavior: The Seven Deadly Sins and the Price Women Pay to be Good. Elise is a great writer, a Big Brain, and my spiritual guide on Substack. I only met Elise recently, even though we are both former magazine editors who have about a million people in common. Elise reads the culture for a living; now applying her sharp but empathetic eye to women and, in her words, “The ancient rules women unwittingly follow in order to be considered ‘good.’” It’s a fascinating read, detailing the behaviors women fall into that prevent them from living a “more balanced, spiritually complete” life.
I wanted to talk to Elise about her chapter on Pride. Women’s reluctance to say they are proud of themselves really gets my knickers in a twist. It’s maddening. Pride is not hubris: I’m pretty sure “I’m proud!” is not the last thing Icarus said before he fell out of the sky.
Anyway, here’s our chat:
LB: I was interviewing Nicole Kidman once and I asked her what she was proudest of. She responded that she didn’t like the word pride because there was, “too much ego” in it. Of course, Nicole is hugely accomplished, and I can totally understand public-facing humility, but it bummed me out: it’s such a female thing to diagnose pride as being egomaniacal. Why do you think so many women reject this idea?
EL: Because you and I have had a front row seat to see what we do to women who are seen as being too big for their britches. It’s a playbook that is so entrenched in our culture that we’re blind to it. The book is about how invisible and insidious all these things are. Pride, healthy narcissism, recognizing that we all have certain gifts - and to be seen and celebrated for our gifts - is a cultural playbook for which we will be destroyed. I’m sure Nicole Kidman spends a significant amount of her mental and emotional energy managing herself and her career so as not to get destroyed.
LB: Yes. I’m Australian (like Nicole, obviously) and we have a super self-deprecating culture. Americans are traditionally more hyperbolic, a little more self-promoting. Which I’ve always admired, to a point. But, living in the U.S, it didn’t take me that long to “own my shit” and be proud of the work I’ve done. And I’d say to friends and colleagues, “You can be proud of yourself; it doesn’t mean you’re a dick.” Do you think it’s easier for a woman to say she’s proud of what she’s done or achieved as opposed to saying, “I’m proud because I’m smart”?
EL: Yeah. There’s such a difference between being seen and celebrated for your gifts, and being like, “I’m the G.O.A.T.” And this would not be unexpected from a man. We don’t expect men to be self-deprecating in the same way we expect it of women.
LB: “I’m the eldest boy!”
EL: Yup. Women are constantly self-deprecating, minimizing, finding ways to celebrate other people to draw attention away from themselves. There’s such a chasm between showing up and being celebrated and being an egomaniacal monster. And yet we can’t even get on plate. And it’s because we have endless, highly visible proof of what happens to women in business, media, on screens, when people turn on them.
[Elise’s book gives the example of Anne Hathaway’s Oscar speech in 2013, which unleashed the Hathahater virus. “The wider world couldn’t abide these offenses: the earnest acknowledgment of a long-held dream, the suggestion she thought it could happen and prepared for the possibility…”]
LB: It is such a thread of the needle for women. But who do you think is on base, who navigates pride well?
EL: We can sense when women want to be liked, maintain their status or cling to it. Which we also punish. I think women who seem to endure are women who are like, “I don’t fucking care, I don’t want to belong to any of this.” They truly belong to themselves. You think about someone like Lizzo or Beyonce, there’s something about them that says, “I do not abide,” and that makes them uncancellable.
LB: Back to the book, I guess Pride being a Deadly Sin doesn’t help its branding?
EL: No. I write in the book about psychologist Eric Malkin’s take: “People end up conflating pride with arrogance, right? And they punish or shame moments of pride…when those normal feelings of pride are shamed, people cut them out, they cut off from them and they learn to connect by leaving pride out entirely.” Eric’s point is that you need to be in the middle. You need healthy pride, it’s very natural and normal to think highly of yourself. I mean, we all think we’re better drivers than everyone else.
LB: What do you think women should take pride in?
EL: I just think women are fucking amazing across the board, I really do. I think we are boxers training at high altitude. We’ve endured and persisted in this culture that’s not really built for us and we’re exhausted, yes, and it’s not equitable. But I don’t know any woman who doesn’t impress me. I’ve met a lot of unremarkable men. I think women are awesome.
LB: What are you proudest of, personally?
EL: Betting on myself and being willing to be seen. I don’t know how much practice I thought I needed before I wrote my own book – I guess I needed to ghost write 12 books – but it’s scary. I’m sure people will come for me, I’ve already offended people. It’s OK. I’m proud of the fact that I’ve done enough work so that I feel resolved and safe in myself and I’m not going to do everything perfectly. I think another Achilles’ heel for women is reputational damage: the worst thing you can do to a woman is to say that she’s bad or mean. I know I’m not perfect, I know I have a lot to learn, I think I have a kind heart, I really want to try to help people. I’m comfortable in that. That durability is not something I would have had even five years ago. So, I’m proud of myself.
Next, Elise’s opinion of “women’s empowerment.” Ooh, I can’t stand it. Read on!
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